Benzo withdrawal: 'attack' symptoms

[Jimmy]

Hey guys

Like the thousands terrorized by CRI's ambition to remove every last benzo script from the 'service' in super-quick time, a good friend of mine is currently undergoing a (way to fast) diazepam reduction. Apart from the obvious craving and other psychological trauma(s), she is feeling what she could only describe as 'unpleasantly weird', a feeling which intensifies with each weekly 2mg reduction. Scoring brown for the first time in years from the street did nothing to ease the benzo-associated discomfort, neither did strong lager recently purchased for the same purpose.

My question is: how does one know when a benzo reduction-related 'attack' is imminent; what the initial signs and symptoms, mentally and physically? Her requests to at least slow the reduction have so far fallen on deaf ears. The moment these 'people' get a foothold (the SU agrees to TRY a reduction), you may as well start digging your own grave; a bit over-dramatic possibly, but, I'm afraid, not far from the truth.

Any advice much appreciated. I am worried for her safety.

Cheers
Jimmy

[sapphire]

Ugh, sounds like what happenned to me and now I have seizures that will never go away.

The problem is though, that unlike some kinds of epliepsy, when you can get a 'aura' type effect warning you that a fit is imminent, with benzo related seizures they come fast out of nowhere.

After my too quick (thanks to a shity GP) benzo taper/detox it took about 12 months before I felt anywhere near 'normal'. I was shaky, worried, scared of everything, it was a nightmare that was far worsr than any opiate rattle I 've ever done.

There is a website called (I think) benzo.org, which deals with the problems that arise from benzo dependance and withdrawal, and they have advice on how quick is 'too quick' and what is safe.

The thing is with a benzo taper or detox, that absolutely nothing will take that shitty nervous feeling away (apart from more benzo's obviously), weed, drink,opiates will not help, in fact I found weed made me far far worse.

Do CRI realise how ill this is making your friend? Could they try a more sympathetic doctor?

[skroe]

Its wrong this, There doing much more harm to people with this ploy to reduce everybody at stupid rates, like my close friend, that passed due to taking some stronger benzos from the internet, that he thought where valuim, they where yellow too like the 5mgs..

As Sapphire as said, people that were on a benzo via a script from the doctor... are now turning too more dangerous ways to self medicate,
Its if your put on Valuim say to help with panic attacks, The person became addicted, but carried on taking "mummys little helpers" to help with the panic attacks etc, then are told that you must come off these straight away, sooner the better, the person is still getting panic attacks, but the doctor don't listen, the person then finds them selves through no fault of there own, choosing risker ways and options to self medicate that are worse than the benzos to there health or liberty.
Its not as simple has that, but just airing a veiwpoint.

Its like the persons illness is there fault, it makes you feel that way i find, When these doctors say there reducing you.
Also the persons illness is still there, Say If it was heart problems or diabetes and the person needed the medication to control these conditions, then was told, No!! where taking these medications from you, there would be uproar!!!
If people aint fixed dont take there medications away from them, simple.


There reducing everyone, They been reducing me, but at a slow rate.

Also they take away the benzo's because there addictive, but give you a concoction of anti depressants etc, that are just as addictive!!!!!!!
Wouldn't surprise me if big pharma is involved somewhere here, They don't make much money no more from valuim, with all the cheaper generic versions now.
So are pressuring Doctors etc.. with there new more expensive non generic "anti depressants"..
I think its wrong

I think you should sign some kind of contract with your doctor, so if your about to start an addictive medication, such as benzo's you would sign this and be on this as long as you wanted with out the threat of your prescription being stopped unwillingly..?? Just an idea..

I hope your friend gets help soon, Its all wrong this..I bet "say no to drugs" campaigner Nancy Reagan, surely she didn’t mean No to Valium??”

[derek d j]

This CRI seem a particularly unpleasant drugs gang.

Did anyone bring up the circumstances of your friend's demise at the inquest?

If these people are cutting their patients down too quickly, they engage in egregious practice and need to be called to account at once. Perhaps you should contact experts in the field of benzodiazpene dependency for their opinions. It wouldn't do any harm to inform the various support organisations as well.

[Jules]

One of very few good articles from the Daily Mail:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1368666/Misery-tranquilliser-addicts-forced-cold-turkey-GPs.html

Also, a guidance presented at this year's RCGP conference:

http://www.smmgp.org.uk/download/rcgpconference/rcgp16/rcgp16p01.pdf

However, I'm not sure that this guidance has been updated but it gives you an idea of how our many good GP's view this problem.

I worry a lot about this problem.

Jules

[derek d j]

5-10% reduction of present - not original - dose every fortnight sounds about right as the fastest rate of benzodiazepine detox possible. And that's the Daily Mail talking.

Do these CRI doctors reduce their patients faster than this? If so, as I've said before and is worth repeating, they need to be called to account.

[Anon33]

I would advise to get a doctor that is not part of the CRI cohort to reassess and prescribe a maintenance dose....if her own GP won't, then she needs to have a scout about her area for 1 that will.
I myself am going to go through this bollox with CRI....I have discussed with my GP who is retiring and he has informed me that you don't need to be a GPsWI to prescribe valium.......the reality is it is HELL coming off and guidance says it must be done slowly and if she is going to have to score just to feel better....then I reckon she needs someone to advocate for her.....and fast.......I have some new stuff on benzos and will upload when I get a chance......much love xx

[froude]

Personally a fast detox off benzo's is torture,and should'nt be allowed ,I was dropped only 10mil over a couple of months and started having these wierd dreams and went back and said"I feel like shit im not doing it its stressing me out more,making me angry and making me into a moaning monster"and they put it up again.Benzo perscription should only be a short term thing ,now ive been on benzo's for 26yrs.If they talk about a reduction in the future,i will be asking for a 2mil drop every month.Im back up to 36mil now and i am still suffering from the last reduction they tried.I know when im needing them as i start to get anxious and also get the sweats.Hope it goes well,all the best Froude

[OP8S]

There is a N.I.C.E pdf file , for the use of GP's that you can download that will tell you whether benzo maintainence or prescribing is beneficial for the patient. I get them prescribed by my community NHS GP for a seizure disorder & have downloaded it just to make sure I fit the criteria. Benzo detox is an absolute nightmare & if the user wants to put the brakes on for a while they should be allowed a little time to adjust. Before I was properly diagnosed I was meant to stop taking them two weeks before the visit to the hospital. I never tapered & it was possibly the worst two weeks of my life, before leaving the hospital I explained to the Nurse as the Consultant I saw couldn't prescribe on the spot. She was very nice & obviously saw the state I was in just thinking about leaving the hospital & catching a bus, people everywhere, that weird feeling of everything being far to real in an exagarated sense. She took me to a staff room or something & gave me a strip of blues. I would of kissed the lady if it wasn't for the fact I was already packing already opening the first couple & melting them under my tongue. It was enough to get me out the city, through an airport & home to see my GP who wrote my usual prescription. I'm hoping because I'm in shared-care that I will not be forced to reduce, the consultants diagnosis & advice will be in my records. It's not a huge amount anyway. There seems to be a benzophobia going around at present, but if they are used for the intended purposes & it's working then I would certainly see that this C.R.I. bunch of mobsters are only in charge of your meth / bupe prescribing. Each GP has there own views. C.R.I. just seem intent on fucking everybodies lifes & sending them back to the street. Not very progressive for the user.

[sapphire]

I would see a non CRI doctor and tell them that the speed of reduction is making you down right ill. Which surely isn't the point?

This CRI seem like, we'll get everyone off benzo's, so what if they're dead - at least they're not on benzo's anymore!

What about when they finish with benzo's and decide "well, we got everyone off benzo's by force, lets start wit the meth and subs?", frightening stuff.

Jules, is there not some "code of conduct" of whatever, that these CRI people must follow, as I hear more and more horror stories about them?

There is a benzo advocacy site out there, not sure what it's called, and they will get involved if a doctor is trying to reduce someone too quick.

I think Derek's right and that 5-10% of the present dose per fortnight is the fastest they are supposed to go, as per the DOH guidelines.

[skroe]

I'm not sure if anybody has seen these seminars, I'll post the links anyway, It is intresting esp if it effects you..

first vid is about benzo withdrawal
http://vimeo.com/4914839

second vid is about anti depressant withdrawal,
http://vimeo.com/4943424

there from this site here..
http://www.april.org.uk/main/index.php?uid=219&

there's other media and links about benzo/ssri's etc on the site also..

[Jimmy]

Thanks for all the advice guys.

As mentioned, my local GP reinstated my zopiclone script and others have had their benzos reinstated in similar fashion - but my friend has had no such luck with her regular GP who refused, point-blank, to have any involvement. There is a dangerous lack of consistency among GPs concerning benzo prescribing; some CRI inmates get lucky, other are basically f***ed - not literally, but you get the gist.

Good or bad I'm not sure, but she did manage to find a black market source and has stocked up on blues and yellows - I mean, seriously STOCKED UP; hundreds of the little blighters. This, she feels, is her only choice; she needs to be able to reduce at her own pace (don't we all!). I can only hope that the result of 'stockpiling' is not a huge blowout and an eventual situation even worse than before. She assures me that this is not the plan; fingers crossed.

I will print off some of the above posts for her - not that showing them to the ex-prison CRI doc will have much impact, but at least she will be aware of places where she can turn for guidance.

Thanks so much to all who replied; the advice and support, as always, is invaluable.

Cheers
Jimmy

[sapphire]

Oh Jimmy, how depressing. They are forcing her back to an active addiction,as youknow with the tempation of all those little fellas sitting round would be too much for the best of us!

[OP8S]

As well as the fact that they are unprescribed & may not be 5mgs, or 10mgs at all. Unless you know the source very well. By forcing people off benzo scripts in this way there has been a serious increase in blackmarket benzos on the market. Another success in the world of drug treatment. Fuckin great. What can they put in the criminal underground's hands next ? Nytol ?

[Anon33]

 :(That is the problem....a couple of months ago ma fella come back frm Scotland with a big bag o blues.....except we both reckon the majority of them were way stronger than any we'd tasted.....in fact I think some were duds and some knocked us out for days....it has been the only time in my life I couldn't wait for them to be finished.....only just got over it .....a coupla years ago we went away to a caravan to do a rattle with what we thought were blues....they weren't....after our speedy retreat home a chemist like pal informed me we had been taking warfarin.....it's a fookin tightrope....I will only take yellows now from my chemist......which reminds me you can get them over the internet in packaging-it doesn't mean they are real, it's just there are some suppliers who are clever